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proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz #16555
11/01/15 10:13 AM
11/01/15 10:13 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 186
Barrington, RI
cstoddard Offline OP
Senior Member
cstoddard  Offline OP
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 186
Barrington, RI

I hereby propose that the J/30 Class Rules be amended as follows:

1) "Rule 5.12.6 Spinnaker" be amended to read "Rule 5.12.6 Spinnakers"
2) Rule 5.12.6.1 be amended to read "Two primary spinnakers may be carried, one of minimum cloth weight 40 grams or 0.75 oz. nominal and 0.9 oz. actual weight, and one 32 grams or 0.5 oz. nominal and 0.7 oz. actual weight. Spinnakers must be made of nylon. Airex 650 is one of several approved cloths that meet the 0.75 oz. requirement, Airex 500 is one of several approved cloths that meet the 0.50 oz. requirement."
3) Rule 6.2.1. be amended to read "The number of sails on board during a regatta series or race shall be a minimum of four: #1 and #3 genoas, mainsail and 0.75 oz. spinnaker. Two additional spinnakers may be carried: a 0.5 oz spinnaker which may be used at owners discretion, and a backup 0.75 oz which can be carried, but only may be used if the primary .75 oz. spinnaker is damaged. The #2 is optional."
4) Rule 6.2.4 be amended to read ": "Except as provided herein, each class sail may be replaced a maximum of once in a calendar year; spinnaker purchases are limited to one per calendar year (One .5 and one .75 may be purchased in the first year of this rule change) . If a new sail is damaged beyond repair, it may be replaced only with the approval of the local fleet governing body. Local fleets may further limit replacement of sails and restrict the use of old sails after they are replaced."
Rationale:

1) The J/30 is notoriously speed challenged in light conditions. Having the option of a
0.5 oz. spinnaker in light conditions would improve the quality of the one design competition by keeping some races from devolving into drifters, in which finish order is often based on luck.
2) As the fleet has aged, more boats spend a greater proportion of the time racing in PHRF handicap fleets. Having a 0.5 oz. spinnaker will improve the competitiveness of the J/30 in light air PHRF racing, which should make the boat more attractive to purchase for PHRF racing (as well as making the boat more fun to sail in light air).
3) By limiting spinnaker purchases to one per season, this change would not have an impact on the cost of ownership, while still adding to performance as noted above.

Implementation:

This rule change would take effect for the 2016 season

Charlie Stoddard
J30 Class Measurer


Charlie Stoddard
Falcon #229
Re: proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz [Re: cstoddard] #16557
11/02/15 09:00 AM
11/02/15 09:00 AM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 128
Summit, NJ
Michael L Offline
Senior Member
Michael L  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 128
Summit, NJ
I second the proposal.

It's an important change among a couple of things I think we should do to make us more competitive in PHRF including:
- ditching the oven rule
- allowing movable jib cars
- removing the restriction on mainsail cloth.

BTW I dislike PHRF racing but its probably what most of us do, most of the time.

Last edited by Michael L; 11/03/15 06:43 PM.

Michael
Re: proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz [Re: cstoddard] #16562
11/03/15 01:07 PM
11/03/15 01:07 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 450
Highland Park, NJ
Steve Buzbee Offline
Senior Member
Steve Buzbee  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 450
Highland Park, NJ
I strongly support this rule change.


Steve Buzbee
Blue Meanie J/30 #485
Re: proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz [Re: cstoddard] #16563
11/03/15 03:37 PM
11/03/15 03:37 PM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 128
Summit, NJ
Michael L Offline
Senior Member
Michael L  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 128
Summit, NJ
What is the process to rule on this?


Michael
Re: proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz [Re: cstoddard] #16564
11/03/15 07:23 PM
11/03/15 07:23 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 372
Rockwood, MI, USA
Russ Atkinson Offline
Senior Member
Russ Atkinson  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 372
Rockwood, MI, USA
In my opinion, we don't need this rule change for one design and we don't need this rule to help to be competitive in PHRF.
I own a composite main, a 1/2 oz spinnaker and an A-sail. All are used for PHRF racing. Only one, the composite main is additive to my costs of racing one design. the others are incremental costs that I decided I needed for PHRF.
Since all boats have the same inventory in one design, all have the same advantage/disadvantage in light, heavy or whatever wind conditions. If this rule is put in place it will greatly increase the cost of one design racing. I would then have to buy a 1/2 oz spinnaker for one design and another for day to day PHRF racing (I have a one design sail inventory and another for PHRF/day to day racing).
My suggestion is to leave the one design rule as is and for those of us that want to buy additional inventory for PHRF - spend the incremental money

Re: proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz [Re: cstoddard] #16565
11/03/15 07:25 PM
11/03/15 07:25 PM
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,591
Portsmouth, RI
Rhapsody #348 Offline
Past J/30 Class President
Rhapsody #348  Offline
Past J/30 Class President
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,591
Portsmouth, RI
Michael,

Class rules paragraph 1.7 states:

1.7 These Class Rules may be amended, altered, added to, or repealed by a majority of the members of the Board of Governors present and voting at a meeting called for such purpose on at least 30 days notice. A quorum shall consist of 40% of the Governors who were serving at the time of the notice, and no action shall be taken without a quorum.

The way it has worked in the past is the District Governors get inputs from their constituents and vote at a properly called election.

Since this was an action from the BOG meeting held 24 Sept at the NAs in Marion, the Class Measurer posted the proposed rule change for the class to comment on. A special meeting of the BOG will be scheduled to hold an election.

Re: proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz [Re: cstoddard] #16566
11/04/15 12:00 PM
11/04/15 12:00 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 450
Highland Park, NJ
Steve Buzbee Offline
Senior Member
Steve Buzbee  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 450
Highland Park, NJ
Russ-the problem is that in some PHRF districts, we are required to use only class legal sails in order to maintain our one design based rating-so carrying a 1/2 oz. is not an option (nor is an aramid main). It seems to me that if you time your sail purchases so that a new 1/2 oz. is delivered just before the NA's, you could then "retire" that chute into your PHRF inventory. That would save the cost of duplication.

FYI-my general strategy is to get whatever new sails I can afford just before the NA's, and then I use that inventory for the next season's PHRF sailing (although I've been sailing with the same sails for the last three PHRF seasons and the last two NA's that I attended).


Steve Buzbee
Blue Meanie J/30 #485
Re: proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz [Re: cstoddard] #16567
11/04/15 12:32 PM
11/04/15 12:32 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 372
Rockwood, MI, USA
Russ Atkinson Offline
Senior Member
Russ Atkinson  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 372
Rockwood, MI, USA
I had forgotten about the PHRF one design rule in your area. I looked it up awhile ago and understand your issue - though I believe it to be only a local issue - others can weigh in on that one

My concern is that it appears that J/30 one design racing will continue to decline I.E nationals. Adding another sail to the inventory for one design will increase the cost and potentially further deter involvement. I think I am qualified to say I'm invested in one design, 4 nationals, 2 mid winters (800-1000 mi one way trips). The cost for me is huge already; an extra main - my choice, maintaining an inventory of good sails for 1 design, a trailer, vehicle to tow it, cost of transporting the boat across country (fuel-permits-time $2-3k transport cost each trip). I really don't want to have to buy another sail

Further, as mentioned, I have a 1/2 oz kite, sail in a light air arena, and hardly ever use it. Not sure I'd buy another for PHRF racing

Bottom line I don't want to and won't fight this fight. I'm committed to one design, you bums are like heroin dealers, I'm hooked. I'm 68 on a fixed income now and not sure how many more nationals I have left - need you folks to go easy on me

Re: proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz [Re: cstoddard] #16568
11/04/15 12:40 PM
11/04/15 12:40 PM
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 450
Highland Park, NJ
Steve Buzbee Offline
Senior Member
Steve Buzbee  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 450
Highland Park, NJ
:-) Maybe your current 1/2 oz would suffice for use when needed for one design?


Steve Buzbee
Blue Meanie J/30 #485
Re: proposed changes for Spinnakers to allow for a 0.5 oz [Re: Steve Buzbee] #16569
11/04/15 12:51 PM
11/04/15 12:51 PM
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 372
Rockwood, MI, USA
Russ Atkinson Offline
Senior Member
Russ Atkinson  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 372
Rockwood, MI, USA
it would be like going to a gun fight with a knife. I had an old #3 that we carried - you saw how that worked out for us last year. Our 1/2oz sail is 7 to 10 years old. Over the years, one problem we found with the 1/2 oz kite has been that we put it up in drifter conditions, wind fills in and we determine its better to keep the kite up than to change it. My 1/2 oz kite is blown out from time and use in wind conditions beyond its range. That's probably one of the reasons we don't find it very helpful anymore

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