Could you all give me a little feedback on your PHRF RATINGS? I have raced J-30's for the past 20 years. Our rating has always been 141 spin class and 147 cruising. PHRF NE wants to change my rating for 2009 to 138 spin and 147 cruising. I do not understand. I have the same equipment. all standard. anyone have a clue why after 20 years they think the boat got faster??????

Well to be honest it should be 135 racing 144 crusing if you are OD. That is the PHRF NE base handicap with 163 #1 and J+1 pole.

What do you have that is not OD? 155 #1?

David
#397

GYA PHRF has the OD configured rating at 138.

From what they told me it had something to do with the length of the spin pole. I am just curious. It really won't change my outcome in PHRF as most of the boats I sail against rate 95 or below. They still owe me a ton of time.

PHRF-NB J/30 OD is 137 Spin / 154 cruising

Friends don't let friends race PHRF when one-design is possible. Bring Heat-'er-Up to from Hyannis to Narragansett Bay for the NAs and join 23 other J/30s at the starting line! You have 3 more days to register... we'd like to have to join us.

Hey Bill,
I have been scrambling around trying to keep the $100 bills in my pocket. I will hopefully be racing to nantucket Sat. I got Zapped at the dock at HYC by one of the high speed ferrys going by. I guess those speed limit bouy's are for the sailors!!! Waiting for my fiberglass guy to fix us. We got a new used main this summer but we still have alot of work to do. I would love to come play but i don't think we can pull it off. I will definatly keep it in mind for 2009. Have access to a trailor so we can travel. If you hear of anyone short on crew I am available. I just don't do bow. Let me know if you would ever like to do the NA's in Nantucket Sound. HYC has put on olympic events and nationals if you are interested i can get you in touch with the right people. 3 Days?

You should measure your pole. If it is 11.5 ft then they should add back the 3 seconds. If it is 12.5ft then that is the correct rating and they must have had it wrong for a long time.

David
#397

Sorry about the ferry damage. Saw your post in the 2009 NA thread. Nice venue for a future event!

Sophia and Wildcat rate 141 on Lake Erie PHRF with 163% #1 and J+1 pole. 3 years ago it was 138. Russ on WC appealed and got 3 sec relief. Don't recall rationale.

Lake Michigan PHRF has an OD J/30 at 138. That is with the class #1 and the class oversized pole.

What other groups of boats do you race against? S2 9.1? J/29? Comparing the rating difference would be more useful.

What would the rating be with a 148% and J+ 1 pole? I had been rated at 135

Taras - in PHRF NE there is a 6 second penalty for sails between 160-170. So you would be 141.

However the boat was designed for a 163 so the sheeting angles etc are all setup for this size jib so it is going to be the fastest and point the best, so I am not sure why people think the 6 seconds is worth it. I measured it with my sailmaker and a 155 is nearly 11 inches in the foot smaller than a 163. My sailmaker thought that was just too much to give up since the boat was designed around the sail.

David
#397

Dave,

The story I heard about the sail is a bit different. When the Johnstones took the first J/30 down to SORC to sail IOR, they found that with J length pole/chute, the boat was slower downwind than they wanted. So they added 1 foot to the pole and could carry a bigger chute.

They could then use a bigger #1 without further penalty under the rule. This became the class #1.

Dunno how accurate that story is.

Could very well be true. I just assumed they set the boat up to be otpimized to the class sail.

Unfortunatly PHRF does not give us that same benefit. Would love to have another 6 seconds and still carry the big Jenny.

David
#397

Rod will be at the BBQ Saturday night at the NAs. We'll ask him!

Bummer I thought the Lobster boil and library visit was Saturday night?

My bad - Rod is at the BBQ on Friday night. You're right David. The Library tour and Elementary School concert is Saturday night.

Elementry School choir better have More Cow Bells!

David
#397

[This message has been edited by dbows (edited 09-17-2008).]

You guys are lucky!!!! On Lake Ontario PHRF the J rates 135 spin, and 153 white sails. We take a 3 second penalty for the 163% and the spin pole each. I have to give a masthead C&C 33 time, in light air that boat crushes me unless I find a breeze he missed. Not that I am complaining.....much! HA HA HA My friend Dan always says PHRF is not a perfect system but its the only system we got.

HHSA
Velocity Girl
#278

We give 9 seconds to the C&C 33's on Lake Erie PHRF. Long downwind legs in light air would certainly favor the C&C's but you should crush them to weather and on tighter reaches. Our A sail has helped. We don't consider the C&C's a threat. We appealed (and won) the 3 seconds on the pole since most one design boats such as the Hobie 33's aren't penalized for oversize poles.

David, If my spin rating with a 148% is 141 (beleive me I wish I had a 163,..just purchashed the j30)what would my white sail rating be? Also 6 seconds less? 159 or 160ish?

Hi David
I measured my spin pole, as I saw in the thread that it had a relevance, so the ratings for my J30 would be based on a 148% genoa / 12ft 6in spinpole
what would my fullsail and white sail rating be?
Thanks
(any 163% sails for sale after the nationals?)

Taras
Hull #532 BreakAway

Taras -

PHRF-NE Base J/30 handicap is 144.

144 - 3 (J+1 pole) = 141
White sail: 141 + 9 (large fractional) = 150

My Handicap:

144 - 3 (J+1 pole) - 6 (163% Genoa) = 135
White sail: 135 + 9 = 144

David
3397

[This message has been edited by dbows (edited 09-23-2008).]

Thanks David

I wonder if we are talking the same things. Here in SWFL we get for Buoy 141 and RLC 138 (RLC random leg course)

thats with a 155
I get 6 for a roller furling ... which is supposed to make up for the fact that it isn't a deck sweeper I guess.
I get 3 for a UV cover
so that gets me up to Buoy 150 RLC 147

And non spinnaker they kick in another 21
and those are Buoy 171, RLC 168

BUT YOU HAVE TO MAX out the size of the genny ... 155 is 0 ... 163 -3
145 adds 3 ... a 148 will get counted as a 155 ...

I have found a 145 a bad combination for PHRF... rather go with a first reef main and the 155 as the wind goes up. I had North build my first reef at 15% instead of 20 ... if I remember right just to help on that.

v

The Narragansett Bay J/30 fleet asked PHRF-NB to look at the J/30 OD rating and successfully had it changed. Last year PHRF-NB changed the base head sail rating from 150% to 155% to be more consistent with other PHRF rating bodies. When they adjusted the ratings last year for this new baseline, the J/30s lost one second to all the boats with similar ratings, but there were no changes to those boats. Here is the result of the 2009 rating evaluation.

PHRF Spinnaker 138 (was 137 in 2008 and before)
PHRF Non-Spinnaker 155 (was 154 in 2008 and before)

With this adjustment, J/30s are now the same relative to other boats.

I also get a rating for just the #3 for when I enter doublehanded races. That PHRF rating is 150 spinnaker and 173 non-spinnaker (no change from before).

I'm collecting data to update the J/30 Class website with 2009 PHRF Rating data to replace the old J/30 PHRF page.

For those that have a valid J/30 One Design PHRF certificate, please reply here and include a response in the following format:
Rating Body, PHRF Spin, PHRF Non-Spin, J/30 Genoa Size %, Base Headsail Rating % - the Base Headsail Rating is the standard headsail size the rating authority uses (even though J/30 OD is 163%)

Examples:
PHRF-NB, 138, 155, 163%, 155%
PHRF-NE, 135, 144, 163%, 155%
Lake Michigan PHRF, 138, 144, 163%, 155%
ECSA PHRF 135, 155, 163%, 155%

For those racing PHRF in a configuration other than One Design, please provide comments with your rating (e.g. roller furling, 155% headsail, etc.

http://www.WestFloridaPHRF.org

PHRF Spin Base Buoy 141, RLC 138 155%
(163 would be -3)

Roller Headstay with cover +9
Vee Jay adjusted Buoy 150, RLC 147

PHRF Non Spn Buoy 171, RLC 168
(they have a magic and mystical way of applying non spin "offsets" in this case they add 21 ... but these offsets appear to follow a somewhat arbitrary formula.)

PHRF NE Base 144
PHRF NE OD 135

LP Adj -6 (>155%)
Spin Adj -3 (J+1)

Lake Michigian PHRF

138 OD 163%
144 155%
147 155% with roller furling credit

John
Madcap #358

The Class Web Page with J/30 PHRF information has been updated. Please check it out and report any missing or wrong information. I've included links to the PHRF rating bodies where I could find them.