J/30 Class Association Forums J/30 Forum One Design Class Rules 0.5 oz Spinnaker

At the recent BOG, the subject of allowing 0.5 oz spinnakers was brought up. I've just purchased a new spinnaker and had to make the choice between what I believed, was to be competitive in OD or PHRF. The BOG discussed some good reasons - both pro and con, for changing the rule. I would like to get a discussion going amongst the membership to see if it's time to change the rule.

We have a number 1, 2 and 3 for upwind sailing. Our only option downwind is a .75.

After talking to most NA sailor over the weekend, most say a .5 in a reaching mode would rip to pieces. I would say this may be the case in winds above 15, so we would use a .75.

The reality of our word in 2014, winds in New Orleans have consistently been under 10 knots the entire year.

The class is approved to carry two spinnakers, why not a .75 and a .5.

Thanks Casey for taking the lead to discuss this topic.

Dave

I used a .6 poly North reaching chute from a higher hoist in phrf in the northwest with great success. I balanced the handicap with only a 153 jib.

I will be watching and reviewing comments on this and will put a recommendation together in January

Some things I'm looking for feed back on

* what wind conditions have you carried the 1/2 to by plan
* what is the material ie Arex xxx
* is this PHRF only
* at what wind speed do you think a new 1/2 is better than a 3/4 in a windward leeward race
* if we are one designing does it really make a difference ?
* what do you think is better a new 3/4 oz vs a four year old 1/2 oz in 8 knots of true breeze ?


For one design events you currently can carry two chutes one to be used only if the primary fails
So like what happened to Smiles at this years N/A's they had a spare 3/4 oz that they could use ( it was blowing 15-18)
So would you now have to carry three chutes ?

look foward to hearing more
Please keep in mind I have been using a 1/2 oz chute in PHRF events for the last 6 years so I know a lot of the answers !

Regards
Charlie

I also have a 0.5 ounce spinnaker that helps in PHRF when the air is light. It is good when the apparent wind is less than 10 kts and carries better than the 0.75 ounce spinnaker in the light breeze. The fabric is North Sails Norlon 50. The sail was purchased in 2008 and gets used about 6 races per year. The fabric is still very crisp. When this spinnaker is used, it is attached with soft shackles and stripped sheets to minimize weight pulling the sail down.

My comment is this is great for PHRF but doesn't make a bit of difference for OD if everyone is required to use the same sails. PHRF-NB does not penalize for sail cloth, only sail dimensions, thus racing this sail in PHRF is an advantage becuase there is better performance with no PHRF penalty. I am sensitive to the desire to keep OD costs at a minimum. Thus, if the 0.5 oz spinnaker were allowed in OD, everyone would feel the need to carry both a 0.5 and 0.75 ounce spinnaker, increasing the cost for OD. The class rules allow a backup spinnaker if the primary spinnaker is destroyed. My backup is an older 0.75 oz class spinnaker that is well used but serviceable. For the "arms war" reason, I would not be in favor of adding the 0.5 ounce spinnaker to the OD sail inventory.... but could see a rules change similar to something proposed below.

Are there any PHRF districts that penalize a OD boat if they change sailcloth? Those districts would have a problem. If there are a significant number of boats that do get penalized for using non-OD sail cloth, perhaps my approach of changing the class rules below would accommodate this.

Existing Class Rule:

5.12.6.1 Minimum cloth weight is 40 grams or 0.75 oz. nominal and 0.9 oz. actual weight. Spinnakers must be made of nylon. Airex 650 is one of several approved spinnaker cloths that meet this requirement.


Proposed Rule changes and interpretations:
Allows the use of a 0.5 ounce spinnaker as a class sail, only when specified in race documents. This is intended to maintain the spirit of one design configuration, but provide flexibility for those who desire to carry a lighter spinnaker for PHRF racing without being penalized for carrying a sail that is not OD compliant.

Potential Class Rule:

5.12.6.1 Minimum cloth weight is 40 grams or 0.75 oz. nominal and 0.9 oz. actual weight. Spinnakers must be made of nylon. Airex 650 is one of several approved spinnaker cloths that meet this requirement.

The class authorizes a light air spinnaker that may only be carried on a boat if specifically authorized in race documents for one design events. This sail shall be considered class legal and may be carried for any PHRF races. Minimum cloth weight is 32 grams or 0.5 oz. nominal and 0.74 oz. actual weight. Spinnakers must be made of nylon. Airex 500N and Norlon 50 are two of several approved spinnaker cloths that meet this requirement.

Just from my experience, PHRF MA does not penalize you for carrying sails outside the allowed one design rating. BUT-having non class legal sails exposes the boat to a ratings appeal, since the limitations placed by one design rules are part of why the rating is set as it is.

I am in favor of adding the 1/2 oz to the mix-we get a fair amount of light air in NJ (especially during our competitive Wednesday night series), and having a little more horsepower in the light stuff would be nice. And in one design, we already have decisions to make on sail selection with the 1 vs. the 3 (and for some, the 2)-I don't see a problem in allowing some sail selection choice on the downwinds as well. And light air would be a bit more fun...

so for those who want to look at the tech spec's on material the following is the links to the AIRX materials

The 600 is the typical PHRF 3/4 oz material

http://www.bainbridgeint.com/Variants.aspx?Item=PRD-900004 650 40 gram .93 oz
http://www.bainbridgeint.com/Variants.aspx?Item=PRD-900003 600 37 gram .86 oz
http://www.bainbridgeint.com/Variants.aspx?Item=PRD-900002 500 30 gram .74 oz

If you allow .5 oz sail cloth into the one design rules, I would expect the handicappers nationwide to review the rating, and probably hit the boat with an ODR rating change.

Charlie, I you sail with a #3 upwind and this sail fails, what do you do? Retire or attempt to use the #2?

Dave
Team Zephyr

Let's make a fact based call on this rather than hypothesize. Each person in different PHRF areas, please contact your PHRF committee and ask if allowing the J/30 to utilize a 0.5 ounce spinnaker would change the rating.

The answer provided by PHRF-NB is no change in rating for a change in sail cloth, only for change in sail dimensions.