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Forums28
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Jul 28th, 2026
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 393
Senior Member
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Senior Member
Joined: Sep 2000
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Thanks Charlie. I have the Spartite in my basement and plan to have it in this spring. But then, I said that last year too.
Looks as if I need to move it up on my priority list from "want to do" to "must do"
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,685 Likes: 1
Past J/30 Class President
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Past J/30 Class President
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 2,685 Likes: 1 |
I didn't do the spartite but instead use cedar shingles wedged in the partners with excess protruding cut off to block fore & aft, and shim side to side to keep the pole centered in the hole before any rigging is adjusted. Probably will go with spartite next time the mast is pulled.
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,234
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Senior Member
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That said when we are hard on the wind going up hill the helm is totally balanced (two finger driving) up thru about 13-14 knots Is this with both jenny woolies straight back or are you balancing by slight pinch ala J24? with inner woolies flying high? and flat water?
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 393
Senior Member
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Vic it doesn't matter
Rule of thumb (even above 13-14 knots) assume weather helm = slow
depower the rig to achieve no or reduce load on helm.
check it out with your speedo or with one of your tune up partners
While your modified rudder is nice for reducing load on the helm, better for cruising perhaps, for racing, the original rudder design will tell you when to de-power, you can drive by feel
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 97
Senior Member
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Senior Member
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@Bill - Re: spartite, you can do it without pulling the rig. It's pretty slick.
Cheers,
Jeff
- Jeff
J/30 #426 - Watusi
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,234
Senior Member
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Vic it doesn't matter
Rule of thumb (even above 13-14 knots) assume weather helm = slow
depower the rig to achieve no or reduce load on helm.
check it out with your speedo or with one of your tune up partners
While your modified rudder is nice for reducing load on the helm, better for cruising perhaps, for racing, the original rudder design will tell you when to de-power, you can drive by feel Actually we prefer to have the boat tell us how to trim into balance, not the tiller ... I know old school ... here is Michael of Belle Faster #537 appreciating a 15 minute no-hands-on-tiller run on a close haul windward for a return spin run a couple of weeks ago. "no hands" I think tops "two fingers" I was trimming to the feel of the boat and hadn't noticed Michael was running hands off. Probably what we need is more trimmers that also have "feelings" I drive 505 with the modified rudder about 6 months a year, but 526 still does have the old rudder which is a pain in the ass over 15 with waves, which are conditions that I think most challenging for an old guy. I also think the modified rudder is helpful in spin runs to control roundups in over 20. In light wind I find it more rewarding to take a nap, or let the gals and kids drive. ![[Linked Image]](https://j30.us/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/download/Number/1096/filename/eIMG-20111223-00124.jpg)
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,234
Senior Member
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In order to get the best up wind performance you want to have the max straight rake in the rig this is achived by have the mast step at min setting (ie as far forward as possible) and the mast as far aft at the deck (mine is set with spar tite) and yes it has to be fixed for the N/A's.
Then you can set the forestay for max lenght. Back stay should be totally loose. With those settings you can follow the tuning guide from your sail maker. I have settings for light (< 10 knots true) medium (8-14) and heavy 14 and up
I only adjust the shrouds not the head stay
That said when we are hard on the wind going up hill the helm is totally balanced (two finger driving) up thru about 13-14 knots
After that the amount of mainsheet trim and travel becomes key to keeping the boat flat and balanced I have never had to two hand the boat when hard on the wind Reaching is a different matter that can be real work
Hope this helps OK Back to Topic ... I'm thinking that Charlie has defined the best under 15 set up here. Which for most of you is probably 85% of your sailing time. 25mm set back at base of mast and forestay at 35' 10.5"This is then the golden rule??? a starting foundation from where all else must be built??? Because in 99% of the time these two measurements appear to geometrically tied together. We are not going to achieve ideal forestay length/tension unless we have ideal step setback length? then we can start talking about Shroud tension comparisons because the geometry is duplicateable? And I think Charlie is right that the sailmakers are using this when they cut OD sails ... which in itself reinforces this golden rule.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 186
Senior Member
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Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 186 |
vic
I use this setup for all conditions up thru 30 knots
The only change I make is how tight the shrouds become as the breeze comes up the lowers and uppers get closer to each other
I will also go to max back stay to open up the main and dump some breeze
Of course you also end up maxing out the mainsheet and then use the traveler (windward sheeting car is the only way to go) to dump the breeze in the puffs,
In a steady SW breeze at 20-22 knots you probably will not even have to work the traveler and the helm should be balanced
Charlie Stoddard
Falcon #229
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 203
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Posts: 203 |
Curious, For 2011, my first season, my mast step is at 7/8" set back. I had my mast all the way back in the partners at 11' 6" from stem at the deck. My forestay measured 35' 9 1/2" with RF Unit extended to max.
Backstay completely loose. At this point I am not willing to wrestle with the 1/8 in at the step. (That would be going the wrong direction)But I do not see how I can get the max Headstay length of 35' 10 1/2 ". Will the tension on the uppers get me the 1" to the goal length? I do want max rake and I want a straight mast with very little prebend. Correct?
Last edited by Conundrum; 01/10/12 04:48 PM.
Don King
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Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 679
Governor at Large
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Governor at Large
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 679 |
I would say we only use max headstay in 0-4 knots of breeze and flat seas. But this is turning into a tuning discussion and it deserves it's own thread somewhere other than the One Design Class Rules, particularly since this forum is only open to owners. A quick search indicates maybe all this tuning talk would be better off in Mast Set Up/Rig Tension. Could somebody cut and paste from this topic say starting here?
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